Stebbins R. 1963 Asian Trip Kanochi Jan. 25 Bakhtiani gave me 1 hr. & then said he had to excuse himself for another meeting. At times his mind seemed to drift off the subject at hand and I seemed less able to get across the nature of music than I have with other people interviewed at higher levels. He seemed most interested in stressing need for equipment and classroom space. He pointed out that they were on double shift, each shift 4+ hrs., and that classes of 40-60 students were common. There could be little individual attention to students. I stressed the desirability of working with native plants outdoors and the value of field trips that stressed careful observation and quantification. He wrote himself a note to the effect that this could be tried and urged that I send him a guide material I might develop along this line. I described how I had been experimenting with simple measurements of plant growth, plotting of plant distributions in quadrats, with children outdoors, to help them get sense the point of view of the scientist and indicated that our "guide lines" document was designed to encourage use of both the indoor and outdoor laboratory in science teaching. He asked that I